That is the part that gets me.....................

because I have know way too many gun owners who seem to have few if any regulations.....

 

It is so fucking simple.

If you don't like the 2nd amendment, lobby to change it. If you can't get the votes to do it, stfu.

 

What does it mean to you? I've heard that Justice Scalia said it meant nothing. Something about it being an independent clause that had no effect on the second clause. What can you do about Grammar Republicans?

It would seem to mean the Federal Government cannot prevent the States from forming State controlled military units. State Militias don't actually exist anymore. The 2nd Amendment is now interpreted by the Supreme Court to say neither Federal, State, or local governments can infringe on the rights of any citizen to bear arms. The States can't seem to regulate weapons which are capable of killing large numbers of people in a very short period of time. Regulations, well or otherwise, are difficult to create. It's strange that a amendment that specifically mentions regulations is now used to prevent them.

As it is now, the National Guard is actually under the command of the US Military, which answers to the President. It has been used to enforce Federal Court rulings. Now that we have no more state militias, how does that square with keeping tyrants at bay?

 

Brother, you just don't know when to quit do you? Look I'm sure in your mind some individual is going to shoot someone to prevent tyranny, but I can assure you that will not be the case. Didn't happen when the colonist's decided to rebel against the mother country, and it won't happen in any other conflict.

 

It's Sunday night and I'm waiting for someone, who will be here soon. I'm just asking questions that you don't seem to be able to answer. Today's firearms are in the hands of individuals. I was just curious to learn how you thought that would guard against tyranny. It is the 21st century, so a few things have changed since 1776.

 

I only mention that one particular weapon as placeholder for automatic weapons. There really is no reason to have a semi or fully automatic weapon, at least none that seem rational to me.

It is also interesting that you immediately jump to the conclusion that I want to ban all guns. Can't seem to have a rational discussion without the "gunnuts" immediate claim you want to take away their rights...

So, why bring up this discussion if you've already assigned others their opinions? Doesn't really seem like you want to discuss this do much as bash others...

 

Given the current state of affairs why would anyone who is legally entitled to a weapon wish to surrender it?

 

First of all, why are AK-47s a place holder for automatic weapons? The AK-47s which people buy here are not fully automatic, they are Semi automatic. Very few people have the required licence to buy automatic weapons. Converting them to fully automatic is highly illegal without the proper licencing and carries a considerable prison term. Conversions to fully automatic are also incredibly expensive.

I'm getting the feeling you do not know the difference between semi and fully automatic, and what weapons belong to what category. Semi automatic means the gun will fire a single bullet every time you pull the trigger and it puts another bullet it in the chamber ready to fire, for every bullet that leaves the gun, the trigger must be independently pressed. Fully automatic weapons you can hold the trigger down and empty the magazine. Automatic weapons include things like M16 assault rifles and Thompson sub machine guns etc, Semi automatic weapons include things like nearly all handguns (excluding revolvers) and AR-15s. That's right, an AR-15 is not an automatic weapon, nor is it an assault rifle.

When did I jump to the conclusion that you wanted to ban all guns? I quite explicitly said the contrary. I said that you only wish to ban guns that would have relatively no impact on saving lives. That your focus is completely misplaced if you had an interest in saving lives. Although now, you have shifted your position from AK-47s to include semi-automatic weapons. So now it appears you wish to ban all guns with the exception of revolvers, bolt action rifles, and pump action shotguns, would that be a fair assessment of your opinion ? At least now we are addressing an area where the types of guns being discussed are actually involved in homicides.

 

Are you an American ? I ask not because I wish to exclude you from the debate, everyone is welcome to bring their opinion. I ask because I don't think you understand the gravity of your position.

The bill of rights, unique around the world, was created for one reason. To limit the power of government, and thus limit the ability of a popular majority from infringing on the freedoms and liberties of minorities. Exactly what people are trying to do today. The constitution is entirely set up in a fashion that prevents one single body from taking over, and removing peoples' rights.

When you say you should abolish the 2nd amendment, this is akin to saying "The majority of this country does not like Muslims, let's make Islam illegal and imprison everyone that practices it". The bill of rights exists precisely to protect dissenters and minorities because they are the ones unable to protect themselves. Just like it precisely exists to protect the speech which we find offensive, not the speech that needs no protection. And of course, just like it precisely exists to protect people's rights to arm themselves and do their duty protecting their liberty from tyranny

There is a difference between abolishing the 18th Amendment of the constitution, and abolishing something that exists as a fundamental part of the bill of rights. Attacking the Bill of Rights is the same as attacking the very fabric of what it means to be an American. Abolishing the 2nd Amendment would set a very dangerous precedent, and the liberty and freedoms which you cherish would be next in line to go, and you would be powerless to do anything about it.

 

Sadly The Bill of Rights has not limited the scale or power of government in any form, it has in effect increased it. Due to so called "activist judges" we have programs like the ACA/PPA. abortion, and corporate dollars equaling free speech, we have lost a limit on political donations due to the allowance of so called "PAC and SUPER PACS".
We as a nation have lost the very basic building blocks of any successful economy.
We have lost the jobs in manufacturing, and construction, farming, and basic use positions because it is cheaper to make it overseas, or to hire people from Mexico to do it for slave wages.
We have no real national identity except to say we are AMERICANS, but what does that really mean?
We HAVE to be Republican or Democrat?
We have to be Christian or other?
We have to be black or white?
Where did the old AMERICA go? The america of the 50s and 60s when families could afford to live decently and not be in constant fear?
Before we can even discuss anything about firearms we have to deal with the elephant in the room, true equality for ALL. Black, White, Hispanic, Asian, Iranian, Somalian, Gay, Straight, Male, Female, Rich, Poor, and even the Homeless. When we tackle that elephant we can move on.

 

I dislike the Supreme Court as an institution. I do not believe that any other democracy gives so much power to judges.

The popularity of Donald Trump among poorly educated white victims of globalism indicates how easy it is to fool that demographic into voting against their economic interests. Those are the same people and the same kind of people who voted for Ronald Reagan.

 

What needs to happen, is this country needs to STOP with the ''classifications'' of individuals, we are ALL Americans, citizens of the U.S., until then, nothing will change, it will only remain the same.

The classifications were created for political expedience, a political advantage, a political purpose, politicians buying votes, political suppression.

When the citizens of the U.S. realize that the federal fucking government has created a victim, by the classifications of U.S. individuals it will balance itself out, until then it will remain the same.

This entire Country was based upon individualism, not collectivism, collectivism has created the entire victim premise.

Individuals have rights, and should maintain those rights, not to loose those rights for a false sense of security. Some folks dont understand what the sole purpose of the federal fucking government actually is.

There will never be a war to prevent tyranny in this country, not as long as the 2nd amendment is still a right of the U.S. citizens.

The federal fucking government is fully aware of this, as long as the people and individuals have the right to protect themselves, the federal fucking government will stay at bay.

 

The sole purpose of the Judicial branch is to interpret the Constitution, as it was written, not what they want it to mean today.

The economic interests of the individual is make their own way, the economic interest of the collective, is to remain the victim, and misinterpret the sole intended purpose of the federal fucking government.

Furthermore, once again, this country is not a democracy, it's a Constitutional Republic, ''RULE OF LAW'', not ''RULE OF MAN'', that is what SCOTUS is determine.

You prove time and time again, you are not a patriot of this country, you are a true blue leftist that encourages the ''fundamental change''....with the failures of Obama, which are many, that has been proven due to the elections of '10, '12, '14 with the democrats losing seats in both chambers, this country does not want the fundamental change that you whole-heartedly endorse.

You're a voice of the minority in this country.

 

Have you read the Constitution as it was written with the thought of the era it was written in?
It says "all men created equal" but at that time "all men" meant men of good standing, land owners, and members of the elite class. The viewed females, and all non-whites as less than a human, if you did not OWN land you had no vote. In just over 4 years we will celebrate the 1st time a woman could vote with the 2020 elections.
The role of the "federal fucking government" is to uphold and represent the will of the people, the whole not just what they feel suits them or you. They are charged with upholding he common and basic peace. to legislate to the will and want of the entire nation. To not un-needingly burden the people with taxation, waste, or programs that do not serve the common man, to protect the peoples interest over seas, and to provide certain services as described with the specific office.
Sadly today all we have is 2 sides with policies and agendas and neither gives a flying fuck about you or me.

 

And that is the way it should still be today, those that have a stake in it should be the only ones to vote, not just anyone that has a drivers license.

TOTAL HORSESHIT... that is not the purpose to the federal fucking government, that is what you were lead to believe the purpose of the federal fucking government, the federal fucking governemnt has over stepped it's sole purpose, and taken away States Rights.

This, I agree with, the system is broken, the system needs to be reformed, it's doesn't need to be 'fundamentally changed', it's a corrupt system, ''RULE OF LAW'' needs to be re-implemented.

 

Actually the National Guard is composed of military members or units of each state. There are a total of 54 separate National Guard organizations in the US. All are controlled by there own state/ territory unless they are federalized by congress, only then do they come under the control of the federal government....

 

As in who? Should the poor be allowed to vote? Those who are homeless? Gays?
I do not believe to any level that any District of Columbia should be allowed, they dont even pay taxes.
Why should Puerto Rico ride on the taxes of people that pay?
But with that why does congress allow their members to participate in insider trading with all legal immunity?

So then by your yard stick what is their role?

 

Good call CS, somehow, I missed Bron's comment.

 

You want my guns?? Molon Labe

 

Never mind...